Why Joe Rogan, Kelce Brothers, Alex Cooper

Talk is cheap? Not for the biggest stars of the podcasting world.

In recent months, several hugely popular podcast personalities have struck megadeals with audio platforms that promise them payouts on the order of A-list actors.

Those include controversial comedian Joe Rogan’s $250 million multiyear deal with Spotify; Alex Cooper (host of “Call Her Daddy”) inking a pact worth up to $125 million with SiriusXM; and the football-famous Kelce brothers signing a deal for their “New Heights” show with Amazon’s Wondery valued at more than $100 million. Wondery also secured an $80 million deal for Dax Shepard’s “Armchair Expert,” and SiriusXM signed the trio behind “SmartLess” — Will Arnett, Jason Bateman and Sean Hayes — to a $100 million-plus contract.

All of these agreements, which run over the course of about three years, include exclusive distribution and ad-sales rights. In some cases, they cover other areas, like rights to develop and sell merchandise and first-look options on new content. Each of those podcasts ranked among the top 20 U.S. shows on Spotify in 2023.

“It’s obviously a very healthy sign for the industry that these checks are being written for big talent,” says Josh Lindgren, head of CAA’s podcast department, who brokered the SmartLess deal with SiriusXM.

One factor behind the new war for podcast talent with mass appeal was Spotify’s recent shift in strategy. When the audio giant dove into podcasting in 2019, it spent hundreds of millions of dollars snapping up studios and tech companies, as well as signing deals with big names including Rogan, Cooper and Shepard to make their shows available exclusively on Spotify. Last year, the company decided to end its platform exclusivity for podcasts because those deals were underperforming on ad sales, according to CEO Daniel Ek. Moreover, podcasters don’t like to be silo’d on one service. “The creator obviously wants to be on many different platforms and wants to have as big of an audience as possible,” Ek told analysts earlier this year.

In February, Spotify re-signed Rogan to a nonexclusive distribution deal, with “The Joe Rogan Experience” now available on rival services like Apple Podcasts and YouTube, but SiriusXM swooped in to nab Cooper’s “Call Her Daddy,” and Wondery pacted with Shepard of “Armchair Expert.”

“When the [podcast talent] deals expire, other companies need to invest to keep up,” says Michael Rueda, partner and head of U.S. sports and entertainment at international law firm Withers. “And they gotta pay market rates.”

During COVID, some companies entered into “irrational” exclusive podcast deals with celebs who didn’t have a track record as podcasters, says Dan Granger, founder and CEO of audio advertising agency Oxford Road. One example: Spotify’s pact with Meghan Markle and Prince Harry, which ended after the couple produced just one series.

Now, says Granger, firms are modeling how the deals will pay back based on historical data. Podcasting continues its upward flight: After a slowdown in 2023, when podcast ad revenue in the U.S rose just 5% following a pandemic-driven surge, the sector is projected to return to double-digit growth this year, increasing 12% to $2.16 billion, per a PwC study for the Interactive Advertising Bureau.

The latest nine-figure deals, while they look pricey, are rooted in solid projections of the ad dollars they could generate. “These are tested shows — these aren’t big risks these companies are taking,” says CAA’s Lindgren. One downside of the trend, he notes: As podcast companies spend big money for big shows, that has reduced some opportunity for smaller, less well-known podcasters.

SiriusXM, for one, is diversifying its podcast roster as its biggest star, Howard Stern, may be ready to hang up his hat. Stern has been the highest-paid radio personality for years, reportedly earning upwards of $100 million annually under his long-running SiriusXM contract. Stern, now 70, first signed with the satellite radio outlet in 2004; his current contract expires at the end of 2025. Regarding speculation Stern may not renew, SiriusXM content chief Scott Greenstein said on the company’s April earnings call, said that if a “singular talent” opts to retire, “you come up with a strategy of what is your current demo and your target audience and you look at what would be best suited for that at any given time.”

A popular podcast can provide a halo effect, giving distributors a way to promote other programming to listeners. “New Heights,” which debuted at the beginning of the NFL’s 2022-23 season, quickly gained a fan base for the Kelce brothers’ comical banter about football, their everyday lives and topics spanning everything from PB&Js to UFOs.

And, of course, it helps that Travis has been very much in the public eye as Taylor Swift’s boyfriend.

“‘New Heights’ on the surface is a sports podcast, and sports is such a well-listened-to category,” says Wondery CEO Jen Sargent. “But it’s become a cultural phenomenon — they’re in that cultural zeitgeist.”

(Pictured above, l. to r.: Joe Rogan, Alex Cooper, Jason and Travis Kelce)